He Liesheng Photo/Reporter Hua Jian
He Liesheng, male, 43 years old, is the head of a company in Nanjing. During the Spring Festival while traveling in the U.S., he made his 4-year-old son DuoDuo cry and run naked for more than 5 minutes in a snowstorm with temperatures at -13°C. After the video was uploaded online, it drew much attention from netizens. He Liesheng interpreted this as "Eagle-style" extreme education, and people compared him to "Tiger Mom" and "Wolf Dad," calling him "Eagle Dad." Some netizens said that "Eagle-style Education" was too cruel, and education should follow the laws of children's physical and mental development. He Liesheng said that "Eagle-style Education" has practical considerations, it is not corporal punishment, and it can make up for the shortcomings of the current educational model.
At 7 p.m. on February 7th, He Liesheng’s family had already finished dinner, but the food on the table had yet to be cleared. They were waiting for He Liesheng to finish one interview after another.
Local, out-of-province, and even foreign reporters have interviewed He Liesheng countless times. He even asked the reporter, "According to your experience, when will this matter end?"
Not only could they not eat meals on time, but there was no question about going to work. "Initially, it was just a casual move to entertain my friends, but I never expected such a huge response," He Liesheng said.
His life rhythm has been completely disrupted, and He Liesheng frankly admitted that he has been feeling quite troubled recently. However, he still politely faced every visitor. The reason is that if the discussion and reflection on educational methods are triggered by "Naked Run Brother," then even if he is criticized, he does not regret it.
Reported by our reporter Fan Siding in Nanjing.
"If I am not cruel, if I am not heartless, I cannot save DuoDuo. You tell me, for a person with a broken bone, would you rather let them lie in bed eating and drinking every day, or let them grit their teeth and do some training? Which is better? Our current 'greenhouse education' and 'strawberry education' are not good for children's growth. I want to establish an educational model that stands in opposition to these, advocating eagle-like love rather than chicken-like love."
-- "Eagle Dad" He Liesheng
"Eagle-style Education"
"Greenhouse Education" is not beneficial for children
Xiangxiang Morning Post: We saw in the video that DuoDuo was crying continuously in the snow and wanted you to hold him, but you didn't. Didn't you feel sorry at that moment?
He Liesheng: As a parent, who doesn't feel sorry for their child? I had DuoDuo at 40, so saying I didn't feel sorry at that moment is impossible. But for me to hold him, absolutely impossible. He has received various kinds of training since he was little, like swimming, roller skating, and climbing mountains, and he always cried. I've become accustomed to it.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: There are many ways to educate, must you use this way?
He Liesheng: I must save DuoDuo! I'm not convinced, who says my child must have cerebral palsy? (DuoDuo was a premature baby born with multiple complications, and the doctor once told He Liesheng that the child might develop cerebral palsy and dementia in the future.) I believe that through exercise and nutrition, I can help him recover health, but these measures are better the earlier they start, so I started training him right after he left the hospital. For example, swimming initially was at thirty degrees Celsius, then gradually lowering the water temperature, decreasing by one degree each time, until it reached 25 degrees. Using this method of cold exposure, I stimulated his function recovery.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Is this what you call "Eagle-style Education"?
He Liesheng: What is Eagle-style Education? My understanding is, when young eagles learn to fly, the adult eagle pushes the young ones off the cliff. In the process of falling into the valley, perhaps only 20 seconds, but to survive, the young eagles must desperately flap their wings, and in this process, the young eagles learn to fly.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Can Eagle-style Education be understood as forcing children to unleash their potential in an extreme environment?
He Liesheng: Ouyang Feng locked Yang Guo in a dark room, where Yang Guo saw many green lights, and realized they were all wild wolves. At that moment, he had only two choices: be eaten by the wolves, or fight the wolves. That day, after DuoDuo went out, he couldn't go back because the door could only be exited, not entered. So, after he went out, he either had to endure the cold or run.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Many parents are tough in words but soft-hearted in practice, unable to actually carry out harsh measures. What makes you so determined?
He Liesheng: If I am not cruel, if I am not heartless, I cannot save DuoDuo. You tell me, for a person with a broken bone, would you rather let them lie in bed eating and drinking every day, or let them grit their teeth and do some training? Which is better? Our current "greenhouse education" and "strawberry education" are not beneficial for children's growth. I want to establish an educational model that stands in opposition to these, advocating eagle-like love rather than chicken-like love.
Tiger Moms and Wolf Dads
Beating is a coercive, inhumane approach
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Many netizens criticize you, accusing you of cruelty. How do you respond?
He Liesheng: I accept the criticism from netizens, but I will continue to adhere to my methods. Some say, why don't you go naked running with your child? I tell them, is it necessary for Ma Junren to run long distances with Wang Junxia? He only provides scientific methods and firm execution. However, I am happy to see everyone discussing. Without controversy, how can there be ideological collisions? And without ideological collisions, how can we progress?
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Now, you are often mentioned alongside Tiger Moms and Wolf Dads.
He Liesheng: We share a common point, which is love for our children. But I disagree with their methods—why must there be beating? That is a coercive and inhumane approach. We can definitely use more advanced methods to educate our children. I think I will talk to Wolf Dad in the future.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Not using corporal punishment is your difference from Wolf Dad and Tiger Mom?
He Liesheng: Eagle-style Education is an educational model based on communication, negotiation, and interest, which is very different from theirs. For instance, before going out that day, I asked DuoDuo, "Do you want to go out for a naked run with daddy?" "The weather outside will be very cold, are you afraid?" After getting his agreement, we did half an hour of warm-up exercises indoors before going out. Also, the age targets are different. Theirs target teenagers, mine target infants.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: You oppose scolding and beating, but in a sense, Eagle-style Education is also a form of beating, albeit invisible.
He Liesheng: Yes, from a certain perspective, we are consistent—they use visible slaps, I use invisible environments, letting the environment punish rather than specific objects. For example, waking up a child, I divide it into six steps: first play music, then turn on the light, then ask if they want to get up, if not, I pat their face with a warm towel, if still ineffective, I pick them up and tell them, "You can sleep a bit longer in daddy's arms, but daddy will put you down soon," once I put them down, they wake up.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: The phenomenon of "Little Emperors" and "Little Princesses" seems to be worsening, with many parents spoiling their children. What do you think?
He Liesheng: Let me say something controversial—I believe that spoiling children is a selfish act. Many parents think that if they treat their children well now, they will be taken care of in old age. I don’t care; I don’t expect him to be filial to me, and it’s not good for him to be tied down by an old man. When children are young, they are constrained by their parents, and when they grow old, the parents constrain the children. What’s the point?
Personal Experience
"I am more grateful to those who were strict with me"
Xiangxiang Morning Post: I heard that DuoDuo takes the bus to school. His school, Yushuibay Primary School, is a prestigious school where students are picked up and dropped off by car. Are you deliberately being unconventional?
He Liesheng: From home to the bus stop is 800 meters, then eight stops, and then another 1000 meters to walk, making a total of 3.6 kilometers round trip per day. First, it is still exercise. But more importantly, I cannot let him feel superior from a young age. We compare academic achievements, emotional intelligence, not wealth.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Was your father strict with you?
He Liesheng: Regarding this, I have some thoughts about my dad.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Is it because your dad wasn’t strict with you?
He Liesheng: Looking back now, I am more grateful to those who were strict with me, like my grand-uncle who forced me to write calligraphy, which I found very annoying at the time. But now I understand, education is strict love, real strictness is great love. I have two teachers, one was very nice, regardless of how noisy we were in class, he continued teaching alone, and some students even threw chalk at him when he turned around, but he ignored it. We thought this teacher was good at the time, but now I realize that he was merely my teacher, very kind, but not responsible towards students. On the contrary, I am now very grateful to a particularly strict teacher.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: The ancients said, read ten thousand books, travel ten thousand miles. The former is school education, the latter relies more on family support. Do you agree with this view?
He Liesheng: Read ten thousand books, travel ten thousand miles, and recognize ten thousand kinds of people.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Recognize ten thousand kinds of people? What do you mean?
He Liesheng: It's about emotional intelligence training. Like Liu Bei, who didn’t read much and traveled later, but gained the hearts of others.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: DuoDuo is so young, how do you train him in this aspect?
He Liesheng: When he was in kindergarten, I gave him homework, giving each classmate a gift every day, which could be candy, peanuts, or gum, given daily to the 25 classmates in his class. Through sharing, he became very popular.
For example, this year he celebrated his lunar birthday in the U.S. Interestingly, in the U.S., instead of receiving gifts, you give gifts to others. In this process, he shared happiness with others, and his emotional intelligence was trained.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Is emotional intelligence more important than cultural courses?
He Liesheng: Of course. But moral intelligence is even more important—benevolence, righteousness, propriety, wisdom, and trustworthiness. If a person's thoughts go bad, it's like a train engine breaking down, and all the carriages behind will be destroyed.
Eagle-style Bottom Line
"No harm to life, no destruction of spirit"
Xiangxiang Morning Post: In China, cultural scores are a hurdle that many parents cannot overcome. If a child's cultural course scores are poor, many parents cannot accept it.
He Liesheng: Eagle-style Education also includes requirements for cultural course scores. Our educational system has its flaws, and I want to use Eagle-style Education to compensate for its shortcomings, but the child's cultural scores are needed. I think DuoDuo can enter Tsinghua University at the age of 10, and if he continues studying, he can finish his master's and doctoral degrees before the age of 18.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Is this a casual statement or a serious claim?
He Liesheng: Serious. I believe Eagle-style Education can fully achieve this. The current education is more than enough for DuoDuo. He is 4 years old this year, but he can study with children twice his age without any problem, and he directly enters the second semester of the first grade.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: You are so confident in Eagle-style Education and DuoDuo, but have you noticed that DuoDuo also struggles in learning?
He Liesheng: Yes, indeed there are. For example, in Chinese language, although he knows 3000 characters, he still has difficulty with writing strokes; also in math, he masters arithmetic within 10, and is currently learning arithmetic within 20. However, these are not problems, I dare say these can be solved within a week.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Therefore, Eagle-style Education is not simply about naked running, it also includes other forms of training?
He Liesheng: I personally witnessed Japanese kindergarten children running in the snow wearing only small shorts. In Korea, children wield wooden swords and poke each other. This kind of indomitable spirit needs to be trained from a young age. Of course, this is just part of Eagle-style Education. I advocate "Ten Quotients" Education.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: It seems you especially like taking DuoDuo mountain climbing.
He Liesheng: Yes, mountain climbing is a sport with fewer injuries and can greatly train one's willpower. This year, I have planned to take him to climb the Five Great Mountains, and also Japan and South Korea's highest peaks, and in July this year or February next year, to climb Mount Kilimanjaro in Africa.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Is it too exaggerated for a 4-year-old child to climb Mount Kilimanjaro?
He Liesheng: A healthy adult usually needs about 4 days to climb Mount Kilimanjaro. Since DuoDuo is small, we can allow more time, anyway we are not competing. Would 8 days work? Would 12 days work? No need for speed.
Xiangxiang Morning Post: Does Eagle-style Education have a bottom line?
He Liesheng: Not harming life, not destroying the spirit, and not forcing.